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EV Charging using 13amp external socket outlet

Former Community Member
Former Community Member
For an external socket outlet to be used as a dedicated EV charging point, what are the earthing arrangements ? Given it will be RCD protected. I assuming this socket outlet will be considered as an EV Charging point under the regs.


Is mode 1 not allowed in the UK anymore? I read this in an article done by IET Wiring matter "According to a note in IEC 61851 Mode 1 charging is not permitted in the UK". If so why is it still in the regs?


Thanks.


J
  • 0
    David Bridgman:

     

    If I was running a 10A plus load for Hours, a 16A BS4343 (Commando) socket would be my socket of choice.

     


    Noting of course that BS 7671 prohibits those in domestic premises, because they are not shuttered.

     



    553.1.201 Every socket-outlet for household and similar use shall be of the shuttered type and, for an AC installation, shall preferably be of a type complying with BS 1363.



    One with an interlocked isolator might be an option, as it's arguably no less safe, but would be a departure.

    OK on caravan and camping sites with kids around (van end of the lead isn't interlocked even if the pitch outlet is) ... but not at home.


    Before anyone asks about the vehicle connectors on EV chargers themselves - BS 7671 permits those, but note that BS EN 61581-1 has requirements such that if the charging outlet is not shuttered, the outlet is isolated when the connector on the lead to the vehicle is removed.


  • 0

    There’s a Tesla adapter for every location.


    The Mobile Connector, previously known as the Universal Mobile Connector (UMC) is a backup cable that all Tesla drivers should carry with them at all times in their car, it allows you to plug into any domestic socket as well as more industrial or campsite style power, as well as connect to other charging cables for extended reach or charging in other EU countries. This visual guide just goes a bit further than Tesla’s support page.



    https://teslaowners.org.uk/kb/tesla-mobile-connector-sometimes-referred-to-as-a-umc-universal-mobile-connector-explained-including-gen-1-gen-2-differences
  • 0
    gkenyon:
    David Bridgman:

     

    If I was running a 10A plus load for Hours, a 16A BS4343 (Commando) socket would be my socket of choice.

     


    Noting of course that BS 7671 prohibits those in domestic premises, because they are not shuttered.

     



    553.1.201 Every socket-outlet for household and similar use shall be of the shuttered type and, for an AC installation, shall preferably be of a type complying with BS 1363.



     




    If the 13 Amp plug is likely to overheat could I not apply 553.1.5 (iii) and use a caravan socket and plug?


    Z.


  • 0
    Zoomup:
    gkenyon:
    David Bridgman:

     

    If I was running a 10A plus load for Hours, a 16A BS4343 (Commando) socket would be my socket of choice.

     


    Noting of course that BS 7671 prohibits those in domestic premises, because they are not shuttered.

     



    553.1.201 Every socket-outlet for household and similar use shall be of the shuttered type and, for an AC installation, shall preferably be of a type complying with BS 1363.



     




    If the 13 Amp plug is likely to overheat could I not apply 553.1.5 (iii) and use a caravan socket and plug?


    Z.




    How do you work that out? (iii) applies to a plug and socket-outlet "not complying with BS 1363, BS 546 or BS EN 60309-2"


    And regardless, 553.1.201 is not a requirement for a BS 1363 socket-outlets to be used exclusively in household and similar use, it's just a preference, but for all socket-outlets for household and similar use to be shuttered.


    I have a 16 A BS EN 60309-2 socket-outlet in my detached garage, but I've taken a decision it's not "household and similar use" because it's for my welder which specifically states it can't be used with a BS 1363-1 plug.


    However, I'm sure there will be people who disagree with my decision and will say that the garage is part of the household ...


  • 0
    gkenyon:


    I have a 16 A BS EN 60309-2 socket-outlet in my detached garage, but I've taken a decision it's not "household and similar use" because it's for my welder which specifically states it can't be used with a BS 1363-1 plug.


    However, I'm sure there will be people who disagree with my decision and will say that the garage is part of the household ...


    I am glad that a recognised authority of Graham's standing says that - I have 16 A and 32 A SP and TP sockets in my garage. I started with a 16 A SP one for a compressor whose start-up current blows 13 A fuses and then I got carried away. ?


    There may be no shutters, but the spring-loaded covers do provide some measure of protection.


    Presumably, BS 546 sockets are shuttered nowadays.


  • 0
    gkenyon:
    Zoomup:
    gkenyon:
    David Bridgman:

     

    If I was running a 10A plus load for Hours, a 16A BS4343 (Commando) socket would be my socket of choice.

     


    Noting of course that BS 7671 prohibits those in domestic premises, because they are not shuttered.

     



    553.1.201 Every socket-outlet for household and similar use shall be of the shuttered type and, for an AC installation, shall preferably be of a type complying with BS 1363.



     




    If the 13 Amp plug is likely to overheat could I not apply 553.1.5 (iii) and use a caravan socket and plug?


    Z.




    How do you work that out? (iii) applies to a plug and socket-outlet "not complying with BS 1363, BS 546 or BS EN 60309-2"


    And regardless, 553.1.201 is not a requirement for a BS 1363 socket-outlets to be used exclusively in household and similar use, it's just a preference, but for all socket-outlets for household and similar use to be shuttered.


    I have a 16 A BS EN 60309-2 socket-outlet in my detached garage, but I've taken a decision it's not "household and similar use" because it's for my welder which specifically states it can't be used with a BS 1363-1 plug.


    However, I'm sure there will be people who disagree with my decision and will say that the garage is part of the household ...




    Would that rule out the use of a B.S.4343 socket or plug?


    Z.


  • 0
    Zoomup:
    gkenyon:
    Zoomup:
    gkenyon:
    David Bridgman:

     

    If I was running a 10A plus load for Hours, a 16A BS4343 (Commando) socket would be my socket of choice.

     


    Noting of course that BS 7671 prohibits those in domestic premises, because they are not shuttered.

     



    553.1.201 Every socket-outlet for household and similar use shall be of the shuttered type and, for an AC installation, shall preferably be of a type complying with BS 1363.



     




    If the 13 Amp plug is likely to overheat could I not apply 553.1.5 (iii) and use a caravan socket and plug?


    Z.




    How do you work that out? (iii) applies to a plug and socket-outlet "not complying with BS 1363, BS 546 or BS EN 60309-2"


    And regardless, 553.1.201 is not a requirement for a BS 1363 socket-outlets to be used exclusively in household and similar use, it's just a preference, but for all socket-outlets for household and similar use to be shuttered.


    I have a 16 A BS EN 60309-2 socket-outlet in my detached garage, but I've taken a decision it's not "household and similar use" because it's for my welder which specifically states it can't be used with a BS 1363-1 plug.


    However, I'm sure there will be people who disagree with my decision and will say that the garage is part of the household ...




    Would that rule out the use of a B.S.4343 socket or plug?


    Z.




    Definitely. It's not shuttered. Reg 553.1.201 still applies.


    BS 4343 was completely withdrawn in 1997 and replaced by ... BS EN 60309-2: https://shop.bsigroup.com/ProductDetail?pid=000000000000372843


    The standard continued to carry the BS 4343 number after BS EN 60309-2 until 1998: https://shop.bsigroup.com/ProductDetail/?pid=000000000000281586


    So, it's one in the same thing ... if you can't use BS EN 60309-2 socket-outlets, you can't use BS 4343 ones.


    And BS EN 60309-1 (non-standard) and BS EN 60309-4 (interlocked switched) won't help with compliance with BS 7671. because again they are not shuttered and Reg 553.1.201 still applies.


    THe only option for a non-shuttered socket-outlet, in my view, is one with an electrically or mechanically interlocked isolator, so the power is effectively isolated whenever the plug is removed. But this would have to be declared as a departure with 553.1.201 ... or you make the decision that a detached garage with operations going on that require industrial socket-outlets are by definition not "household and similar use".


    Difficult to determine an EV charging station is not "household and similar" especially when the EV charging standard requires domestic chargers to have shuttered sockets, or electrical/mechanical interlock in the way I've described.


  • 0
    This reminds me of the bayont lamp holder and safety discussion in the other thread.  EN 60309/ bs4343 are probably a lot safer than lamp holders, but have history against them, being quite modern, and so not able to claim a long history in circulation.

    Unshuttered Schucko sockets are no longer accepted either,  and I suspect the same driver is at work.


    It would have been  possible to have shutters on a BS4343 socket,  as a rotating disk of holes, with the ramp on the earth pin, much as the common 13A designs. Sadly I suspect it is too late to add this.

    And yes I too have the sockets in garage and shed, and add it to the list of not quite compliances.

    Still safer than a 13A plug when water is about like a pressure washer.

    Mike.
  • 0
    I do not understand the fascination with shuttered sockets for these loads. BS7671 has probably followed some EN or IEC here, but why is a domestic more dangerous than a factory or farm? Europe does not generally have shuttered sockets either, and small children are very unlikely to be getting at a socket in the garage or whatever. The 13A plug is for general use, for which it is usually fine, and the shutters probably prevent a few incidents, but a BS60309 has the socket connections well buried in plastic and the pins cannot be touched due to the skirt, etc. It would take a very agile small finger some effort to touch the brass, on a 16A size. A hand could probably go into the 63A size, but you wouldn't have one of those in the Garage, at least I don't yet, although I have several of smaller sizes. Other BS sockets do not have shutters either, so there is NO ALTERNATIVE for loads of more than 13A and BS60309 are better than BS5?? (forgotten the number) anyway. Do the Car connectors have shutters?
  • 0
    BS546 15A plug/socket?  That would handle 10A all day without getting warm.  You can even get shuttered versions of them.

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