Anyway you’re missing the point, you don’t need to be a tradesperson with installation electrician qualifications or experience to do EICRs, indeed you don’t have to be an electrician doing installation domestic installation work to do landlords EICRs though the guidance does say the inspector should be capable of doing the repairs.

In order to be fair to some doing the inspections I remember I disagrred with a 2391 tutor over his exam in part.

We were given a mock set up and told we must find 12 (I think) defects.

He said to list all defects even though there might be some you are not sure about because if you list say 20 defects even though there are only 12 defects present then you stand a good chance of not having missed any of the 12. My response was thate surely if you cited a non defect as a defect you should be deducted a point for it.

But no he would not have it.


If that is taught then it is hardly surprising that some doing inspections might actually believe some of their own errors and that`s before we even think of the fraudulent job creation gang

Does anyone remember the Emma Shaw case?

2012 43 Summer Wiring Matters (theiet.org)


Z.

Then there was the Mary Wherry case. Proper testing, installation and a working R.C.D. would have prevented a death most likely.

Botched wiring killed mother | London Evening Standard | Evening Standard


Z.

Are you just trying to inflate your postings count Andy?


I think that the EICR problem can be solved, and in some ways, we have the threads available. Without letting any cats out, there are quite a few people who post here who can push things along. This group of people regularly discuss many things to do with the regulations and the Industry. I think that there is significant awareness of the problem, and there are contacts, such as the HSE who have teeth to help. The way that the system works is slow and depends on a lot of paperwork evidence. Just saying ABC would be a good idea, is not really possible, it needs a technical paper with references and documents to back it up. Thanks for those already provided, maximum proof is needed (photos and extra description if possible)


Andy (Sparkingchip) above seems to be suggesting that an EICR of value needs an Inspector who has a book of codes and little underlying knowledge. I do not agree, and this is why there are so many duff EICRs floating about. There is a common factor with all of these, the inspector doesn't know anything like enough about safety, and conflates safety with or lack of it with "not being exactly to latest regulations", or more likely "doesn't match the onsite guide. The discussion we had about the 1.5mm spur on Zoomups ring circuit when examined is fully compliant with all the regulations, but I bet you would not find many "Inspectors" who would have a clue, and would according to NAPIT code it as C1 without a thought.


This is the basis of the problem, far from 2391 being too hard, it is nothing like hard enough! If the pass rate is 10%, so be it, 90% of candidates are not knowledgeable enough to do the job. Go away and learn some more engineering! The next problem is the teachers available to teach 2391, it is no secret that JP used to teach a class and I would fully expect that he got reasonable pass marks. We both found the same teaching the 18th exam. Most candidates could pass just fine, but the odd one who failed the open book exam really didn't have much clue, or there was another underlying difficulty. I taught one Guy who had not declared he was autistic (which C&G ask and can give more time) how to pass the exam by understanding how to find the right item in the index over lunchtime. In the morning test, he failed badly, after lunch and the real thing he passed just fine, no Alcohol was served so it wasn't that, and the sandwiches contained no magic mushrooms (mine didn't anyway!). No one got 100%, out of several hundred, and I think only one person got all but 1 question correct, and he is active here!


One last point which GK pointed out, I was not excluding Ladies, at present I think only one is posting (Kelly), but I completely refuse to put "Persons of unknown sex" or something similar (it seems there are now 367.5 sexes according to the BBC). Many Lady electricians would love to be considered positively by their male peers! I make no discrimination.


Please keep the paperwork coming, I need more!

Andy, surely you are not suggesting that those two cases, sad as they are, is justification for condemming installations which are fully compliant? I suppose you mean that if they were installations exactly to the latest regulations neither would have happened? If so you need to provide hard evidence as to why. A stuck RCD wouldn't, would it but if you are suggesting that new installations are totally safe under all conditions you are miles wide of the mark. A few people will always have accidents of some kind. Take "smart" motorways, presumably to all the latest regulations, but killing more people than before those regulations took effect (traffic not electrical).


The ultimate effect of over coding is that less inspections are ordered, the fear of excess costs is very real. To do any overcoding on assumed "saftey" grounds is simply FRAUD. I assume you know what the BBB says on the matter.