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Re-Wire of existing EVCP



Hi all,

I'm sure you can advise..?

I'm designing a re-wire of an existing TN-C-S outdoor facility which includes an EVCP installation pre BS 7671:2018, and changing out the TP+N DB and final circuit wiring for new. Whilst make making a large assumption prior to a site visit, I am not aware of the EVCP being TT install and expect the PEN to be providing the earthing arrangement. As I am providing a new final circuit supply, is this statutory that I remove the PEN and provide an an earth electrode to bring the EVCP upto BS 7671:2018? Irrespective this is best practice and will be employed.


Thanks

Neil
  • Despite the moniker, BS 7671 "Wiring Regulations" has no statutory force.


    If this EVCP is not at a dwelling, then the exemption at 722.411.4.1 would not have been available.
  • BS 7671 "Wiring Regulations" has no statutory force.

    They're starting to get some - for private rented dwellings they're a statutory requirement, likewise for any installation that contains parallel or switched alternative generation (according to the ESQCR). Even in other situations the contract with the customer is likely to require delivery of an installation that complies with the wiring regs - so you could potentially still end in court for failing on that point even if it's then a civil rather than criminal case.


    In any event, if you're entirely replacing the circuit and wish to certify if complies with the current edition of BS 7671 (which is likely what the customer requires) then it makes sense to do it properly. That doesn't necessarily mean TT islands though - there are models of charge point that claim to detect (most) broken CNE conditions and disconnect all conductors (including the c.p.c.) in that event - which BS 7671 says is an acceptable alternative. If it's all outdoors and each charge point (& vehicle) can be well out of reach of anything connected to the CNE, my preference would be for TT.


       - Andy.
  • Chris Pearson:

    Despite the moniker, BS 7671 "Wiring Regulations" has no statutory force.


    If this EVCP is not at a dwelling, then the exemption at 722.411.4.1 would not have been available.


    But if you knew about a risk, and did nothing to address it, or at least bring it to the attention of the person responsible to the installation, who's at fault?


  • gkenyon:
    Chris Pearson:

    Despite the moniker, BS 7671 "Wiring Regulations" has no statutory force.


    If this EVCP is not at a dwelling, then the exemption at 722.411.4.1 would not have been available.


    But if you knew about a risk, and did nothing to address it, or at least bring it to the attention of the person responsible to the installation, who's at fault?




    It's not so much a matter of fault, but liability. Knowing about a risk takes care of foreseeability, but you would still have to establish that a duty of care existed (you might think that this is obvious, but proceedings have been initiated against me twice for adverse events which had nothing to do with me). Then there is the standard of care, which is to comply as far as is reasonably possible with BS 7671; and let's not forget causation.


    But that wasn't the point that I was making above. If the site is a dwelling, then a PME earth may have been used; if it isn't, then it should not have been used.


     


  • Chris Pearson:

    Despite the moniker, BS 7671 "Wiring Regulations" has no statutory force. . . 


    No, but we will not connect a customer’s installation that does not comply with the latest edition of BS7671 to the Public Electricity Supply. On our Test Certificates, the installing electrician signs to say the installation complies with the latest edition of BS7671. 


    Regards,


    Alan. 


  • Alan Capon:
    Chris Pearson:

    Despite the moniker, BS 7671 "Wiring Regulations" has no statutory force. . . 


    No, but we will not connect a customer’s installation that does not comply with the latest edition of BS7671 to the Public Electricity Supply. On our Test Certificates, the installing electrician signs to say the installation complies with the latest edition of BS7671. 



    Well yes, but you put in the service head and then somebody else (at least in England) comes along and puts in a meter. When mine was put in by Lowri Beck, I was given an "IMPORTANT SAFETY NOTICE" which recommended (no more) that "an NICEIC approved Electrical Contractor" be contacted before turning on the main switch.


    There may be an element of chicken and egg, but I wasn't going to put in an installation until I had a supply.


  • Thanks all for the assistance, very helpful!