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Would the engineering community be happy with an independent Northern Ireland?

Arran Cameron
One of the thorniest problems with Brexit is where to place the 'hard' border between the UK and Ireland. Should it be between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland or between Northern Ireland and the Mainland?


Voting in Northern Ireland in the EU Referendum was very much along sectarian lines with the Protestant and Unionists communities predominantly voting Leave and the Catholic and Republican communities predominantly voting Remain. An exception to the rule was North Down but that has similar demographics to Surrey. Therefore, wherever the 'hard' border is located it has the potential to re-ignite the Troubles and in a worst case scenario a return to the 1970s.


An alternative is for the Mainland to leave the EU and Northern Ireland be granted independence from the UK as a member of the EU.


1. Would the engineering community (on both sides of the North Channel) be happy with an independent Northern Ireland?


2. If a referendum is held on whether Northern Ireland should remain as part of the UK or granted independence, then should it only be held in Northern Ireland or should it be held throughout the UK?
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    On question 1, I think this is a decision for the Irish (North and south) and not the engineering community. The problem with an independent Northern Ireland is that it does not have a functioning government even for its present devolved status.

    Question 2. Such a referendum is already provided for in the Good Friday agreement and would be a referendum of the whole of Ireland, but I believe I am right in saying that the result in Northern Ireland would be paramount.
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    John Mann:

    On question 1, I think this is a decision for the Irish (North and south) and not the engineering community.




    It has the potential to affect the engineering industry, and ultimately the engineering community. Probably to a lesser extent than Brexit or an independent Scotland though.






    The problem with an independent Northern Ireland is that it does not have a functioning government even for its present devolved status.




    It's a bit cheeky saying this, but in the absence of a functioning government, Northern Ireland can always be run directly from Brussels. The majority of people in Northern Ireland voted Remain.




    Question 2. Such a referendum is already provided for in the Good Friday agreement and would be a referendum of the whole of Ireland, but I believe I am right in saying that the result in Northern Ireland would be paramount.




    I will have to double check on this one but I think that this referendum is a choice between the Union and a United Ireland with independence not being an option.



     

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    There are already a number of "borders" in the Irish sea including educational systems, legal systems, Health systems.  Not sure what the who ha is all about re another border.
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    John Mann:

    Question 2. Such a referendum is already provided for in the Good Friday agreement ....




    We (UK) have already reneged on the Good Friday Agreement as it provided for Northern Ireland and the UK working with the Irish Republic as part of the EU. The question on where to place the "hard border" ignores the fact that nobody voted for a hard border as this question was not asked on the ballot paper. All the "vote leave" campaigners were holding up Norway as an example (much to the confusion of the Norwegians who state that they pay more into the EU than they would if they were members) and Norway does not have a hard border. Of course, no-one voted for a "soft border" either, so neither group can claim they have a mandate.

    Alasdair

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    Gerard O'Neill:

    There are already a number of "borders" in the Irish sea including educational systems, legal systems, Health systems.  Not sure what the who ha is all about re another border. 




     

    That's not actual borders.  We are talking about a border between the EU free trade zone and a non-EU UK.  At the border, you can be stopped, and your vehicle searched to see what you're carrying.  If you have goods in the back, you will need paperwork to say where they are from, where they are going, and if tax has been paid.


    If you pop over the border for a shopping spree, you could also be stopped and asked to pay tax or import duties on what you've bought.
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    Simon Barker:


    That's not actual borders.  We are talking about a border between the EU free trade zone and a non-EU UK.  At the border, you can be stopped, and your vehicle searched to see what you're carrying.  If you have goods in the back, you will need paperwork to say where they are from, where they are going, and if tax has been paid.


    If you pop over the border for a shopping spree, you could also be stopped and asked to pay tax or import duties on what you've bought.

     

    Very true. It's not just physical goods but services as well.


    How much engineering is there in Northern Ireland and how tied-in is it with the Mainland? If there is an independent Northern Ireland, or a hard border in the Irish Sea, then will this be likely to result in engineering companies closing their operations in Northern Ireland and relocating to the Mainland (not in the EU) or the Republic of Ireland (in the EU) where there is potentially more stability?
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    I don't know how much these posts are connected to this issue:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-46291361


    I can't comment too much on this as (from my previous employment with Bombardier) I am privy to confidential information which I am certainly not going to discuss. But just to say it is a very, very, very, complicated (and hugely difficult) situation of which Brexit is just one of many factors.


    Whatever the rights and wrongs I do feel for them.


    Andy

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